MORRIGAN:

MERRY MEET AND WELCOME TO WICCA 101! Tonight we are having an open discussion on Astral Projection.

As I will also be warding the door, you will have to command the floor yourselves this evening. though I will take part as I can

someone please define Astral Projection

melilot:

travel without your body parts involved

MORRIGAN:

Astral Travel: leaving your body either consciously or unconsciously and traveling to the inner planes

Stickman:

or outer planes

WiseWitch:

chatty, I'd say more traveling VIA inner planes, to locations inner or outer.

MORRIGAN:

Does anyone have any questions regarding this subject?

OK, I've only heard it described as inner planes

Autumnwitch:

how can you train yourself to do it consciously?

MORRIGAN:

yes I believe that you can Autumn

melilot:

time patience and practice autumn

WiseWitch:

But = if you astral travel to a visit a friend's REAL house, then aren't you on an outer plane location?

melilot:

it's easy but it's hard

MORRIGAN:

in fact there are many many books out there on the subject, and an entire religion centered around it called Eckankar

WiseWitch:

Ekkkk, Eck!

MORRIGAN:

good point WW, that's true though I don't think I've ever done that myself

WiseWitch:

I've projected to "real" locations.

MORRIGAN:

does anyone here have any experience with this?

WiseWitch:

Got my astral feet wet in a flood once [g]

MORRIGAN:

cool WW!

melilot:

but aren't those locations also in the inner plane and therefore you could be in the inner or outer at the same time

MORRIGAN:

I myself only do it unconsciously and never seem to go to "real" life places... that I know of anyway

WiseWitch:

Probably, Meli. But, say you were projecting and trying to read a sheet of paper somewhere. That's more likely outer only

Trollfrog:

shaman types do this on a regular basis...

ViragoWomyn:

I once projected unconsciously to my dad's house in Australia... scared the hell out of my stepmom!!!

IrishWitch:

Are dreams astral projection ever?

Azrael:

Oddly enough, I can't project except if I take a nap in the afternoon.

WiseWitch:

Can be, Irish.

MORRIGAN:

also, in Silver's book To Ride, she describes sending "watchers" and I think that this would be a sort of astral travel too wouldn't it?

IrishWitch:

I don't

Stickman:

have to descend into yourself before actually Projecting that's what astral projection is, otherwise your meditating

WiseWitch:

Don't recall that part of To Ride, only skimmed it.

IrishWitch:

I think watchers are more like Guardian Angels. They aren't you

MORRIGAN:

Irish, often you remember what happened as a "dream". As you gain more experience you can begin to tell the dream from the Astral Plane

IrishWitch:

They are familiars? Watchers that is.

MORRIGAN:

In Silver's book she talks about Watchers as being a part of yourself that you send off to witness other things sort of like being in two places at one time

IrishWitch:

What a great thing!

MORRIGAN:

not like familiars Irish

WiseWitch:

Great, like we're not all distracted enough all the time as it is...

MORRIGAN:

{g}

IrishWitch:

This is a bit confusing.

melilot:

like sitting in your living room but "seeing" what's happening in the garage

IrishWitch:

I found it so in Silver's book , too, but accepted it.

WiseWitch:

rather see into the bedroom, myself.

IrishWitch:

Got you Chatty

ViragoWomyn:

LOL

melilot:

LOL WW

PAniteowl:

was wondering if when I "see" others thoughts, is that the same thing??

MORRIGAN:

hmmmmm PA I don't know if it is

melilot:

I don't think that's the same as AP pa

MORRIGAN:

sounds more like a telepathy of some sort

ViragoWomyn:

I've got a problem of sorts, with projection... have a real problem with slipping into it, unconsciously... and also frequently have problems returning...

MORRIGAN:

or mind reading thing

ViragoWomyn:

any advice on returning?

MORRIGAN:

VW I've read that if you begin to think about your body you will return to it naturally

ViragoWomyn:

BTW- that was unclear... I slip into it too easily.

WiseWitch:

At finding your body, or getting back in?

ViragoWomyn:

Chatty- even then, I have some problems...

melilot:

think about needing to go to the bathroom to pee VW it works

IrishWitch:

LOL Mel

ViragoWomyn:

at getting back in...

IrishWitch:

{--- here too

ViragoWomyn:

LOL Meli... that sounds like it would work!

MORRIGAN:

turn and look for the silver cord and follow it back VW. I never have that problem myself. I don't do it consciously EVER... Yet, does anyone who is able to do this consciously have any suggestions that others can try?

Cathbad:

I never have a problem getting back in or finding my way back.

IrishWitch:

Can I ask a really basic question?

MORRIGAN:

please!

IrishWitch:

OK.

Cathbad:

Somehow, I think I never actually leave, but simply project onto another place, simultaneously staying where I am.

IrishWitch:

Do you just decide that you want to AP, lay down and do it? Or is it more a subconscious thing like daydreaming?

MORRIGAN:

like what Silver describes as a "watcher" Cath?

Cathbad:

I don't know. I know that it is very difficult to maintain, and far from not being able to get back, if I lose concentration, I snap back.

WiseWitch:

It can be either, Irish, depending on how much control you have

PAniteowl:

wait, we're all talking about different phenomena

Cathbad:

(Which hurts.)

melilot:

but wouldn't you still be partly with your body since you are still connected to it

Stickman:

it sounds like there is a personal obstacle. kind of like a block in your chi, maybe doubt

MORRIGAN:

well Irish... I'm no expert on this mind you, but it is something that the body does unconsciously at random I think, but it can be a learned skill through meditation and concentration

Cathbad:

meli, I feel like I'm still very much connected with it. In fact, I've found that I'm still vaguely aware of my physical surroundings.

IrishWitch:

Thanks Chatty, that clears up a lot for me

MORRIGAN:

welcome... talk about the blind leading the blind here {G}

ViragoWomyn:

LOL...

MORRIGAN:

I've read some Eckankar books on this and the author stressed concentrating on the inner screen behind your eyes

PAniteowl:

OK... here's my 2 cents ... I have never realized when I've traveled astrally, but others have told me when they've seen me or mostly "Heard" me ...

MORRIGAN:

eventually, according to him, pictures appear and if you "let" them draw closer you find yourself "in" them and on the Astral plane... or one of them

Cathbad:

I'm still a little vague on why it's called "astral" projection.

PAniteowl:

However, when I concentrate to use my "sight", I am indeed in that place ... like a memory, although I may have never been there

melilot:

don't know if that's AP so much a telepathy pa I hear you but don't see you sometimes

Cathbad:

With me, I've never traveled on anything but the physical plane. Though, obviously not physically.

PAniteowl:

yes, mel ... that's what I do {G} but I don't know when I'm doing it {G}

Cathbad:

The technique I've read somewhere...

melilot:

LOL pa it's OK I like it {eg}

ViragoWomyn:

LOL

PAniteowl:

{VBEG}

ViragoWomyn:

voyeurs... {g}

WiseWitch:

Cathbad, I'd say that the worlds overlap. You use astral body travel, but on this plane. Others use it on the astral plane too.

IrishWitch:

LOL

MORRIGAN:

hmmm this seems to be much more involved that I previously thought. There seems to be many different ways to do this

Cathbad:

... involves memorizing the room in every detail...

PAniteowl:

I agree, chatty there are as many forms as there are trads {G}

IrishWitch:

isn't that just photographic recall, Cathbad?

Cathbad:

and relaxing, with your eyes closed...

melilot:

as many ways as their are people I think chatty {g}

Cathbad:

(No, there's more.) Then, you imprint the entire structure of your environment on your mind. Much like any kind of visualization.

WiseWitch:

But you move from viz to projection when you can see any changes in the room, as it is NOW.

Cathbad:

After a while, for some reason, the similarity between your visualization of the room, and the actual reality of the room become one, and your "astral" body becomes separate.

PAniteowl:

Cath ... I seem to pick up others mind pictures of a place

Cathbad:

That sounds like Telepathy, PA.

Xori:

I have a question of an experience I had not too long ago

PAniteowl:

places I personally have never been

ViragoWomyn:

yes, xori

IrishWitch:

I dream those PA

PAniteowl:

even their past lives Cath?

Cathbad:

Perhaps.

ViragoWomyn:

::shrugs::

Cathbad:

Maybe your doing some sort of psychometry.

Cathbad:

But with people?

Xori:

my daughter had been irresponsible and didn't come home from school and didn't check in - it was almost dark and I was very very worried, I then decided to meditate to see if I could

PAniteowl:

I dunno ... but I can control it most of the time ... and others, well it just blossoms {G}

Xori:

pick anything up - I found myself seeing her and feeling that she was scared, I could see some things around her but I didn't know just where she was, but I put me energies to let her know I was there and she would be safe and that she should find a phone - after ward she called soon after, and I really thought it was just my imagination, but she says she "felt" me would that be like AP?

Cathbad:

Could be.

MORRIGAN:

I don't think so Xori... more like mental telepathy I think

Cathbad:

Could be telepathy of some sort.

melilot:

part AP part telepathy

IrishWitch:

So then, Chatty what IS AP?

Xori:

I thought so too. We are very in tune psychically

Cathbad:

Perhaps you can project yourself into her aura?

PAniteowl:

OK, is astral travel, then , a telepathy?

IrishWitch:

Going to unfamiliar places to unfamiliar people?

Cathbad:

(Yes, I'm really grasping at straws here.)

melilot:

{--- getting her websters out

Cathbad:

I mean maybe you can manifest through her. Sort of like AP through her as a Gate.

MORRIGAN:

Astral projection, to my understanding, is when your spirit actually leaves your body and travels outside to either other physical places or to the inner planes

Cathbad:

Great, I haven't a clue what I'm talking about now.

PAniteowl:

heheheh ... join the club, Cath

Xori:

chatty, in AP, is one conscious of leaving their body?

IrishWitch:

I think we may all be lost on an astral plane

MORRIGAN:

some can do this consciously yes Xori, other do it unconsciously

Xori:

From what I've read, some are able to see their bodies

I see

MORRIGAN:

Yes, I've heard that too.

IrishWitch:

Isn't that meditation?

PAniteowl:

Chatty... when I am "seeing" someone else's experience, I am truly "THERE"... but I don't think of it as astral travel

MORRIGAN:

My personal experience of AP is always in my sleep and never a conscious thing.

melilot:

mind travel to a supposedly existing level just beyond normal human perception

MORRIGAN:

no, I don't think that's AP PA

IrishWitch:

{{{---- here too

Xori:

PA - how would you term your experience - that is what I felt in that instance with my daughter

IrishWitch:

I cannot imagine getting a "control" on it!

What a trip!

PAniteowl:

yes, Xori... I think it is more like traveling on the Web... to a specific location. there is a connection and you seek it out

Xori:

I see, that's a good description - thanks :)

PAniteowl:

but to just leave the body... and travel randomly, no, I haven't consciously done that

MORRIGAN:

Many term AP as a "vacation", something that you do only for pleasure, but I know some people who actually do work there

melilot:

I think dreaming is more of an AP experience in some cases

MORRIGAN:

for instance there are the guardians, like I think Red Star is

PAniteowl:

yes, some "Heal" in astral

Xori:

right

IrishWitch:

Hmm

MORRIGAN:

who work to keep nasty little entities in line sort of like Astral Police if you will

IrishWitch:

LOL

melilot:

LOL

Xori:

that's gotta be a tough job!

melilot:

not if you are equipped for the job xori

MORRIGAN:

yes PA, I've heard of healing in the astral... happens very quickly with great results!

PAniteowl:

Edgar Cayce was a healer of the astral plain

MORRIGAN:

from what I understand it is indeed Xori, one doesn't actually get much "rest" while they sleep

Xori:

true meli

IrishWitch:

Oh, so those who are light sleepers are more likely to AP? I often dream about the next day... .

melilot:

nope Irish just light sleepers {G}

Xori:

I don't know too much about guardians, except for what Red's taught me

MORRIGAN:

actually, I don't think that its that tough for a person to do once they get the conscious part of astral travel down anyway.

melilot:

red's good xori

IrishWitch:

In really MUNDANE ways... . could that be the same?

MORRIGAN:

I think it would only take a basic understanding of chakras and energy and how the body functions

PAniteowl:

Red is very good Xori

melilot:

light sleepers are more connected to the "real" world heavy sleepers would be more connected to the astral

MORRIGAN:

hmmm I don't think so Irish, but I'm not sure

I think I agree with Meli on this one Irish

Xori:

I know - he sent me stones last year that have helped me a great deal - and so has he

IrishWitch:

Thanks.

PAniteowl:

when I have been told about my travel, I do not remember it... and I don't remember any dreams

melilot:

really amazing man red is xori and funny as all get out at times

MORRIGAN:

hmmm there may be a block there somewhere then PA that keeps you from remembering

Xori:

I know - we have very lengthy discussions from time to time - he's wonderful

melilot:

well if she's visiting me I know what the block is {EG}

PAniteowl:

It happens mostly when I am stressed... and I don't really try to drain energy... but I think it happens when I'm at a low point and need to contact others

melilot:

I sometimes will wake up and not know where or when it is still connected to a location and time other than the one my body is in

MORRIGAN:

for a bit of spiritual rejuvenation perhaps? {g}

PAniteowl:

I think I block it out because I feel it is an infringement on the person I am contacting

Xori:

that's interesting PA

MORRIGAN:

I've had that happen as well Meli

PAniteowl:

Yep Chatty

melilot:

I don't think you could infringe on the person pa the person would have to "let" you take the energy

MORRIGAN:

hmmmm so it's something that you need to ask permission on? Have you tried doing that?

PAniteowl:

I think that's why people "hear" me, more than "see" me

MORRIGAN:

like you're being tentative with your contact then.

PAniteowl:

I think I am indeed asking their permission

melilot:

well pa you have my permission to drain me when ever you need to {g}

PAniteowl:

{G} thanks Mel

yes Chatty

Gwendydd:

yes, often when I need an energy boost I often project to a partner in another state, and it really helps, we often (with permission) turn to each other like this

PAniteowl:

it can be "scary" to some who are not expecting it

MORRIGAN:

PA needs to carry around some agate! for an energy booster! {G}

PAniteowl:

remember the first time Mel?

melilot:

but you forget pa that you "give" as well as take

oh boy do I pa {G}

MORRIGAN:

well PA you can come visit me any time you wish! Just don't tell any of my secrets {eg}

PAniteowl:

hehehehe

Gwendydd:

nor any practical jokes {g}

melilot:

now I'm so use to it I would feel empty if it wasn't there pa

MORRIGAN:

LOL that's right!

Xori:

I love practical jokes

melilot:

{-----is a very practical joke

MORRIGAN:

has anyone ever had the flying dreams?

IrishWitch:

Yes... All my life until

Xori:

LOL {{{{{{{{meli}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}

Autumnwitch:

yes

Gwendydd:

yes

PAniteowl:

If someone is "receptive" and is not frightened of the phenomena, then I feel it is OK to "visit", but I wouldn't want to just intrude and scare the crap out of anyone

IrishWitch:

I actually flew!

Xori:

oh yes - I have lots of flying dreams

IrishWitch:

I love to Fly!

PAniteowl:

hmmmm ... I ride a Pegasus {G}

IrishWitch:

Actually have learned not be afraid of it.

Xori:

but most of my dreams are about houses that I've never seen before

Gwendydd:

I ride a white dragon

IrishWitch:

Can tell myself that it is "just" a dream

Same here Xori.

Did you ever see one later?

Spooky.

Xori:

you dream about houses too Irish?

IrishWitch:

Yes.

MORRIGAN:

well I think, and this is only my opinion, though others hold it as well, that when you fly without any object helping you ie horse, plane, broom...

Gwendydd:

you're lucky Irish, it feels to real to believe that it is a dream

MORRIGAN:

then you are actually projecting

Wolfmoon:

what is astral projection

IrishWitch:

Now I have better grip on this thing Chatty

melilot:

what about with wings chatty

Xori:

I did - just from the outside though - just like last weekend - I actually pulled the car over and marveled at it - mostly though I see houses from the inside

IrishWitch:

Me too

PAniteowl:

heheheh... wish we knew, Wolfmoon... it is still a puzzle

IrishWitch:

I "know" where things are

MORRIGAN:

Astral Projection is when the spirit leaves the body and travels to either the inner planes or other physical places

Gwendydd:

and it is wonderful right chatty

PAniteowl:

ahhh... Irish, yes... I "know" where things are too {G}

Wolfmoon:

does it happen when you're sleeping most of the time?

MORRIGAN:

yes, in an unconscious way, though it can become a learned skill with work

Xori:

Me too Irish - if I were to actually go in

IrishWitch:

No, I mean I "know" where to walk next, what I'll see, etc.

MORRIGAN:

and I'm no expert on it so... take my opinions for what they are worth

IrishWitch:

Kind of like Photographic memory of a place I've never been

Gwendydd:

I have learned to do it when I am awake, and when I need to

Wolfmoon:

I think it happened to me once

Xori:

My house dreams seem to be about exploration of many rooms and hidden staircases and such - but some are of like regular track houses

MORRIGAN:

do you have any advice to pass on to those who would like to learn how to do this Gwendyd?

Wolfmoon:

in it I was driving down a back road

IrishWitch:

Same here, Xori... keep going to one or two places all the time too! Get a bit further along each time I visit.

MORRIGAN:

then it is quite possible that you are experiencing a past life dream Irish

IrishWitch:

Eventually, I'll get it all. Kind of like life, no?

Xori:

what a trip!! - I have asked around incessantly about house dreams and no one has been able to help - thanks IW

IrishWitch:

Maybe Chatty. I also visit one cemetery all the time, too.

MORRIGAN:

though with dreams your interpretation is always better than a strangers {G}

Gwendydd:

when I first started to do it consciously I would go into a semi trance, and when I felt relaxed I would bring up an image of where I wanted to be, or who I wanted to be with, and then I would believe that I was already there and I would actually be there

MORRIGAN:

so your experiences are all on a physical plane Gwendydd?

Xori:

Gwen - do you do this with you're eyes open or closed - out of curiosity

Gwendydd:

no, also on a spiritual plane, there are times that I go places that I know do not exist here on earth

MORRIGAN:

Gwen, did you feel your spirit departing your body at all?

Gwendydd:

sometimes open xori, but usually closed all the time chatty

MORRIGAN:

is there a particular place that you feel it Gwen?

Xori:

thanks Gwen - I meditate with eyes closed, but it is more like dream, but I really have something happen with eyes open - suddenly things go black and then I begin to glimpse something then I snap back. this happened just this last Friday in fact

Gwendydd:

it's like for a moment I am floating above my body like I am rising up from my chest and I look down and see by body is safe and off I go

MORRIGAN:

so out of your chest then around the solar plexus?

Gwendydd:

yes, usually using the solar plexus, there are times though that I exit through my third eye

MORRIGAN:

xori, that exact circumstance was described in a book I read about AP

OK... just wanted to make sure my "source" was correct. That is what the book described Irish.

I think that you may have been on the verge of AP... perhaps. It's hard for me to say one way or the other having never had the conscious experience myself.

that was directed at Xori BTW

Xori:

I'm sorry - what book was that Chatty?

Gwendydd:

the funny thing is that I never read about it, it has always just kind of come naturally to me I can remember even doing it as a child.

MORRIGAN:

Irish, do you ever see a blue light right before you project?

ummm I think it's called "How I learned Astral Projection"

Xori:

OK - thanks - I've been practicing every Friday lately - no one is here then, and I'm getting some good experience, but the eyes open thing is becoming very intense, but just glimpses

Gwendydd:

I usually see a white light

MORRIGAN:

NO, it's called How I learned Soul Travel by Terrill Willson

Solastar:

I just tried it

Xori:

got it :)

MORRIGAN:

now, it's an Eckankar based book, but goes into very little religion and the exercises in it are very good and comprehensive it's basically a journal of his trials and errors and ultimate success at AP

IrishWitch:

I seem to have a "Better" at some times of the month, than others.

melilot:

yet another book to get {G}

MORRIGAN:

with lots of suggestions for you to try there's always one more Meli! {g}

that makes sense Irish since some women are more powerful or more connected during certain phases of the month

IrishWitch:

Oh, yes, I need to keep better track of it.

Solastar:

like the tides

MORRIGAN:

keep a journal of your efforts, all who are all who are trying this. That way you have a record of what worked better and when and perhaps why.

Gwendydd:

I found that a diary works well

MORRIGAN:

yes Solas, like the tides {G}

IrishWitch:

I guess you could record it in your book of shadows, no?

MORRIGAN:

Why not? I do. But then I have a section in my BOS for everything I do spiritually

IrishWitch:

LOL Me too... too many sections sometimes I think.

MORRIGAN:

LOL... me too. But it's worth it.

IrishWitch:

Yes

Xori:

I have been doing that IW - you should see it - is but such a jumble - luckily it's a loose leaf binder :)

IrishWitch:

Mine too...

MORRIGAN:

that way I can correlate what else has been going on as well as far as dreams and general life, or readings go

IrishWitch:

Took that advice right from Silver Ravenwolf

Xori:

I've yet to get separators - that's the next task - and organizing

MORRIGAN:

Me too Irish!

Xori:

Me three :)

IrishWitch:

Hey, if it works...

MORRIGAN:

well folks... it's ten o'clock so I suppose we can go on to other topics now. thanks for showing up and participating,

Xori:

thank you chatty!!

Autumnwitch:

Thank you Chatty.

MORRIGAN: